Finding Your Calling with Jerry Fu – Episode 60

Data Leadership Lessons
Data Leadership Lessons
Finding Your Calling with Jerry Fu - Episode 60
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Watch this episode on YouTube: https://youtu.be/q60ocqGjvVA

Jerry Fu is a conflict resolution coach who helps Asian-American leaders advance in their career and life journeys. After several pharmacy leadership roles, Jerry started coaching in 2017 to help other Asian-American professionals deal with the conflict they encounter at work, with their culture, and within themselves. Jerry’s journey will inspire you!

Save 20% on your first order at the DATAVERSITY Training Center with promo code “AlgminDL” – https://training.dataversity.net/?utm_source=algmindl_res

Connect with Anthony J. Algmin on LinkedIn – https://www.linkedin.com/in/anthonyjalgmin

Data Leadership Lessons Home – https://DataLeadershipLessons.com

About our Guest:

Jerry is a conflict resolution coach who helps Asian-American leaders advance in their career and life journeys. Having taken on several pharmacy leadership roles, Jerry started coaching in 2017 to help other Asian-American professionals deal with the conflict they encounter at work, with their culture, and within themselves.  

Prior to starting his coaching business, Jerry served as a pharmacist and began facilitating leadership workshops in 2012. Today, Jerry offers a range of coaching services, which includes individual coaching, group workshops, and keynote presentations. He has appeared on over thirty podcasts and plans to appear plenty more.

Home Page – https://www.adaptingleaders.com.

LinkedIn profile – https://www.linkedin.com/in/jerry-fu-pharmd-acc-53710187/

Episode Transcript

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anthony_algmin: Welcome to the Data Leadership Lessons podcast. I’m your host Anthony J.

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anthony_algmin: Algmin. Data is everywhere in our businesses, and it takes leadership to make

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anthony_algmin: the most of it. We bring you the people stories and lessons to help you

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anthony_algmin: become a data leader. Find subscription links and more resources to make an

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anthony_algmin: impact with data leadership at DataLeadershipLessons.com. Today we

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anthony_algmin: impact with data leadership at DataLeadershipLessons.com. Today we

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anthony_algmin: welcome Jerry Fu. Jerry’s a conflict resolution coach who helps Asian

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anthony_algmin: American leaders advance in their career in life journeys. After several

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anthony_algmin: pharmacy leadership roles, Jerry started coaching in twenty seventeen to

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anthony_algmin: help other Asian American professionals deal with the conflict they

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anthony_algmin: encounter at work with their culture and within themselves, Jerry. welcome

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anthony_algmin: to the show.

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jerry_fu: Anthys for having me.

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anthony_algmin: So like we do with all our first time. Guess why don’t you just take a

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anthony_algmin: moment few minutes. tell the audience a bit about. Tell the audience a bit

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anthony_algmin: moment few minutes. tell the audience a bit about. Tell the audience a bit

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anthony_algmin: more about your career before becoming a coach and how it leds you to doing

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anthony_algmin: what you do now.

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jerry_fu: Certainly. yeah, um, I knew I want to do something in health care when I started

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jerry_fu: college, but when I got a C in organic chemistry, I knew I had to iv it quickly

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jerry_fu: from my premed aspirations, and well, you know that wasn’ an inst mountable thing.

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jerry_fu: at the time in my mind, I thought that was the death of my Uh physician dreams,

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jerry_fu: and so Um, I said Well, let me uh, do something else in health. Do something else

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jerry_fu: in health care and what was available. Well, pharmacy was and so I said. Well, let

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jerry_fu: me convince pharmacy school that I would make a good pharmacist, and at the time

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jerry_fu: um jobs were in high demand, Uh salaries to start the scale up pretty quickly,

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jerry_fu: And so I thought, Oh, I you up. It’s a good time to ride this wave. And so my

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jerry_fu: mom and I uh, slightly disagreed on the the path that I should take in pharmacy.

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jerry_fu: Uh, it wasn’t that it was that different, but she felt one chain pharmacy was

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jerry_fu: better than another, and so for Uh, due to my own conflict aversion, I just

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jerry_fu: basically went with with her recommendation and Um was not happy with it,

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jerry_fu: but I, at one point I, I became complacent and I, you know, had some nice things

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jerry_fu: while I was working there, and so I held on to as best i could, but when i, after

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jerry_fu: about five years, when I had a really bad customer service incident, I just said

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jerry_fu: nope, I’ve had enough I need. To find something else, and so part of what you can

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jerry_fu: see is building up here, right Isce the customer service aspect, Uh, in pharmacy

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jerry_fu: or a chain pharmacy, specifically, Uh, kind of leaves you unsatisfied or

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jerry_fu: reseentful After you dealt with enough difficult, patienttis or customers, right,

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jerry_fu: they say it doesn’t matter. You know how unfair or howreonable Uh, their stances,

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jerry_fu: Uh, we need them to be paying customers, So mean it’ just kind of easy to, you

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jerry_fu: know, to kind of dampen it down a little bit. and I said Okay, this isn’t going to

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jerry_fu: work long term, So all that to say,

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anthony_algmin: Can I ask you one thing? I want to ask

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anthony_algmin: you one thing about that in particular, So

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anthony_algmin: I imagine that

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anthony_algmin: people that are drawn to doing pharmacy work often

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anthony_algmin: are thinking about that kind of scientific side of it, The medical side of

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anthony_algmin: you’re thinking about dispensing the the medications, understanding the

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anthony_algmin: medications. It reminds

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anthony_algmin: me of. When I right out of college, I became a stockbroker, because

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anthony_algmin: I love the financial analyst side of it and I love

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anthony_algmin: thinking about stocks, and I like connecting it to people’s recommendations

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anthony_algmin: or whatever. But I quickly learned that being a stockbroker was a sales job.

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anthony_algmin: It was all

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anthony_algmin: about people. It mattered way less how well you analyze the securities, and

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anthony_algmin: more how you interact with your customers or potential customers and your

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anthony_algmin: people or whatever. And it sounds to me like what you found in pharmacy was

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anthony_algmin: the same kind of situation where like your focus was over here Like this is

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anthony_algmin: I’m doing this work. But then you found the reality of it was. It’s a

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anthony_algmin: customer service position as much as it

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anthony_algmin: is anything, and that completely overwhelms any of the

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anthony_algmin: rest of the experience. Am I reading that right? Is that a fair parallel?

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jerry_fu: Oh, that’s absolutely the case. Um. Well, part of it is, Yeah, you. you have to

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jerry_fu: build relationships regardless of whatever profession you uh, choose right,

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jerry_fu: whether you’re an accountant or a stockbroker or a pharmacist or a physician or an

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jerry_fu: engineer. Anything like that right, you have to manage a relationships. Well, Um,

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jerry_fu: you know whether it’s your team or customers or clients, things like that and at

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jerry_fu: the same time, Yeah, if you love data, and do you want to focus on it? Yeah, get a

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jerry_fu: research job. You know where people leave you alone, right,

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jerry_fu: they say. Oh, well, he’s the technical expert. We’re just going to let you know.

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jerry_fu: Give them a couple guidelines and they get out of his way. But you know, if for a

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jerry_fu: retail job which is very visible in the community, right, uh, yeah, relationships

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jerry_fu: are inevitable. and

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jerry_fu: yeah, the funny and sad thing is that in these retail pharmacies, you’re basically

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jerry_fu: giving away your clinical knowledge for free. Right if you call me and ask me a

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jerry_fu: drug question and I tell you, and you say Hey, thanks, Jerry. Click, right, I

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jerry_fu: didn’t get paid for any of that, so now I have to upsell gummy bears and

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jerry_fu: batteries, just to you know,

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jerry_fu: offset the fact that I’m giving clinical knowledge for free. Soa. yeah, um, not a

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jerry_fu: not a great business model. If you’re going to want to, uh, get paid to give

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jerry_fu: clinical knowledge right,

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jerry_fu: Um, so yeah, all’ll that to say, so I leveraged my network, Um, because I wanted

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jerry_fu: to get into teaching pharmacy students, but I didn’t have a residency or a p

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jerry_fu: because I wasn’t working on my career. Uh in pharmacy soap, Uh, levers the

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jerry_fu: network. My, a friend of mine who worked for a pharmacy consulting company here in

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jerry_fu: Houston, said, Hey, you know, we uh, have an open position Since I got promoted.

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jerry_fu: Do you want to apply for it? I said, absolutely. so I walk away from a full time

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jerry_fu: job with benefits and just earned the third week of vacation, And I said That

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jerry_fu: doesn’t matter if the other forty nine still stink. I don’t want to be around

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jerry_fu: here, so I take this job hoping that this will be the last company I I would ever

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jerry_fu: have to work for And I know how jealous a lot of my friends were when they found

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jerry_fu: out that I’ you know was given this opportunity. Just got a gift raft to me,

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jerry_fu: Um, it’s not the convince them I was worth taking a chance on, but you know, uh,

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jerry_fu: anyway, eleven months later I get fired and it’s like Oh, what do I do now? right?

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jerry_fu: uh, the shame, the embarrassment. Everyone’s going to be asking questions, right.

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jerry_fu: uh, The simple answer is that I liked the idea of being instructor, and more than

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jerry_fu: actually doing the working, becoming an

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jerry_fu: instructor. A big challenge was the fact that in my chain pharmacy job, as long as

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jerry_fu: I was doing a better job than like seventy or seventy five percent of the work

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jerry_fu: force, Um, and I knew some really incompetent pharmaces, Do you know

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jerry_fu: that or on the payroll? And as they said well, you know, as long as I’m better

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jerry_fu: than seven five percent, you know, my boss will be fine with me, but now in this

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jerry_fu: smaller company, I’m being held accountable to the position I was hired to do, and

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jerry_fu: I learned quickly that Uh, your boss is. Not paying you to give them stories as to

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jerry_fu: why I didn’t get the job done. Boss is paying to get the job done and I didn’t.

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jerry_fu: so. Um, it wasn’t love. It didn’t feel loving. At the time. It was very painful,

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jerry_fu: but it really was. You know. the wake up call. I needed to re. recognize that.

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jerry_fu: Hey, whatever I was thinking or doing was not going to work. Um, that’s when the

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jerry_fu: roller coaster got really weird. After about six weeks of unemployment I managed

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jerry_fu: to find my way into a job. Uh, very naive at this point as to what kind of uh, you

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jerry_fu: know shady things are going on in Houston. I ended up at a independent pharmacy

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jerry_fu: job where four of my paychecks bounced while I was filling for rooed doctors, So

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jerry_fu: double whammy. I’m jeopardizing my license and this guy’s ripping me off like I’m

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jerry_fu: not even getting paid. so uh in my conflict aversion, right in the same way I was

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jerry_fu: afraid to deal with the Bos who’s upset with me. Now I have a Bos who’s ripped me

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jerry_fu: off and I have no idea how to confront him right. I’m you know, I’m frustrated.

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jerry_fu: I’m anxious because the only way I even have a chance of getting paid is if I move

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jerry_fu: more. Uh, you know shady prescriptions

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jerry_fu: right, And so thankfully, my friends got me out of that job, Um, after about nine

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jerry_fu: months, and then got me on with a Li, a legitimate company. but uh, they said Hey,

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jerry_fu: we like you, but we can’t pay more than eight hours a week, so I said okay, So

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jerry_fu: rent your groceries this month. I just don’t know which one to go with. Um. I end

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jerry_fu: up working for them out in Austin, which is about two and a half hours away from

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jerry_fu: Houston. Uh, uh, just to get more hours, and now I have no idea what my life is,

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jerry_fu: go to look like. So that summer was very pivotal because some friends of mine who

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jerry_fu: run a pharacy leadership non profit, said Hey, We know you’ve been facilitating

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jerry_fu: leaderships on the fraternity side, But uh, leadership, Uh, Spot opened up for our

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jerry_fu: national meeting would be willing to help facilitate this workshop with us, and I

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jerry_fu: said absolutely,

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jerry_fu: And so teaching leadership kind of unlocked some different thinking in me In that

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jerry_fu: before I say, Oh, leadership is hard. the times I tried it, I wasn’t good at it. I

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jerry_fu: don’t know if I’ll ever be good at it, but now, uh, after teaching it and seeing

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jerry_fu: it modeled for me, I said Well, what if I could be a good leader? You know, what

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jerry_fu: would that look like how to carry myself? What kind of work would that involve?

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jerry_fu: And so that fall I had the chance to either stay part time in Austin with A, which

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jerry_fu: was a great team, or uh, take on a full time manager position that it opened up in

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jerry_fu: Houston, and I said Well, I’mm ready to come home. I can’t be afraid of these

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jerry_fu: challenges. I’m gonna take this on the following year. I proceed to get written up

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jerry_fu: by management because I was not uh, disciplining or firing uh, problematic

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jerry_fu: technicians. Because the this ongoing theme of conflict diversion, Oh hi, and I

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jerry_fu: want to be liked. I want to be respected, which is too. act exclusive. Things. You

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jerry_fu: can’t be like them respected. You know, it was very hard to balance the two right,

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jerry_fu: And so God in the dog house had to figure my way out. Managed to get myself, you

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jerry_fu: know, Uh, off probation, right as the company had their funding poll. Basically

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jerry_fu: the owners at that point had decided that Uh, the business model that we were

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jerry_fu: investing in was no longer sustainable, so they decided to move on, and the only

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jerry_fu: reason I got an interview with my next company was that I had leadership

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jerry_fu: experience on my resume now

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jerry_fu: and I said, Wow, you know, leadership really saved my career. You know, first my

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jerry_fu: friends were kind enough to give me a fish to help, kind of get me out of this

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jerry_fu: chain pharmacy complacency, and now I’m being taught to fish. And so now you know

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jerry_fu: I can actually get the attention of other companies. Um. Unfortunately, with these

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jerry_fu: smaller pharmacy jobs that actually offer a a good quality of life, they don’t

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jerry_fu: last very long. I call them icebergs, so it’s nice that to have more icebergs to

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jerry_fu: hop two, but they’re still melting, and so four years ago when my previous

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jerry_fu: employer went under, Um, I said Well, I’m tired of fighting insurance companies

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jerry_fu: and tired of chasing scripts, but I love teaching these leadership workshops which

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jerry_fu: I consistently done since Um. twenty twelve when it first started.

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jerry_fu: What would a career in coaching look like? Um, What kind of work would that

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jerry_fu: involve? and so still scared to fail, Still scared of rejection. I’ve you know,

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jerry_fu: some friends are kind enough to hire me, so it was kind of like a hobby at this

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jerry_fu: point,

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jerry_fu: and it took a pandemic right for me to finally say how much longer I’m going to

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jerry_fu: wait. Uh, so yeah, last October, if I, the ▁l, ▁l C got the website up, and now

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jerry_fu: it’s just try, Circle fail until I can transition out of my day job,

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anthony_algmin: Yeah, well, and this is a a story that aspects too like I’m not in the the

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anthony_algmin: pharmacy space, But

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anthony_algmin: aspects to this really resonate with me and I’m sure resonate with a lot of

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anthony_algmin: the audience out there. Is that

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anthony_algmin: you. You’ve been through some rough stuff. you know, some, some bad luck,

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anthony_algmin: some self

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anthony_algmin: imposed challenges. Some

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anthony_algmin: you know opportunities to learn about your own weaknesses or proclivities,

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anthony_algmin: and I appreciate you being open and sharing that with us, Um, and then

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anthony_algmin: having the courage to keep getting off that mat when you’re beaten

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anthony_algmin: down and then find the courage to take a even bolder step into going into

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anthony_algmin: coaching and finding this thing. It reminds me like Ive, I’ve long said,

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anthony_algmin: because I’ve been doing data work and and data management were pretty much

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anthony_algmin: my whole career pretty much since I ▁quit. being a stockbroker. And and it

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anthony_algmin: was it, and

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anthony_algmin: that only lasted like six months. I got the the The

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anthony_algmin: certifications and then quickly realized what I had done and got out of it.

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anthony_algmin: Um, but

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anthony_algmin: data and and different aspects of it technology and all that called to me

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anthony_algmin: early on, and at

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anthony_algmin: one point it was probably about Uh. At this point, probably like seven,

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anthony_algmin: eight years ago I said to myself, and I was doing comfort speaking and I, I

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anthony_algmin: had a chief date officer role and I’d you know, been kenoading things and

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anthony_algmin: stuff, and I, and’m like you know, this has been such a wild journey through

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anthony_algmin: these different positions. the programming stuff, did Um. consulting. I had

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anthony_algmin: opportunities to to lead and I’m like. What are the chances that I ended up

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anthony_algmin: doing this stuff And it got me thinking and I’m like, You know,

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anthony_algmin: the more I think about it, the more I realize that this life, this role,

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anthony_algmin: this thing that I’m doing has been calling to me for my entire life, And I

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anthony_algmin: remembered back in even high school, I didn’t know about data management or

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anthony_algmin: data leadership careers. You know I didn’t

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anthony_algmin: know like, but I knew

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anthony_algmin: that I’m like. I want to do something that I can be respected and I want to

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anthony_algmin: do something where I can be Um, leading things that. I want to be a a, a

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anthony_algmin: knowledgeable person in my area and I want to

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anthony_algmin: be completely anonymous outside of it like I am never going to

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anthony_algmin: threaten Joe Rogan for podcast listeners because this

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anthony_algmin: is not that kind of show

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anthony_algmin: right like And that’s and that’s okay, Because the audience I want to reach

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anthony_algmin: is A is hopefully a deeper, more specific connection. And when I think about

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anthony_algmin: it as I think about it, I’m like. What are the chances that I would be end

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anthony_algmin: up doing this? I’m like. The more you, it’s like it’s a hundred percent. it

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anthony_algmin: is a hundred percent that I was going to end up doing something like this.

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anthony_algmin: Now the details?

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anthony_algmin: Yeah, that’s all crazy random or whatever. But every time I made a new

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anthony_algmin: choice it pulled

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anthony_algmin: me in this direction to take you like to address something that wasn’t right

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anthony_algmin: before. And and it’s

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anthony_algmin: for me, I knew functionally pretty early in my care Like this is what I do.

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anthony_algmin: This is what my life’s work is about. this is this is,

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anthony_algmin: this is who I am. For me, it’s always been in context. It’s always been

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anthony_algmin: like. I don’t know if I should be doing this on the industry side and

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anthony_algmin: consulting side is an entrepreneur, as a, a contentt cre or whatever, some

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anthony_algmin: combination of a, all but to know what you do and to have that calling. to

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anthony_algmin: listen to it, Like to me that that’s what’s so exciting about hearing your

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anthony_algmin: journey Is

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anthony_algmin: that this has been calling to you and you have. you have taken different

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anthony_algmin: steps towards it

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anthony_algmin: and now you’re at this point where you’re like. Yes, this has come together

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anthony_algmin: to now, I feel that this is what I was always supposed to do. and now I’m

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anthony_algmin: here so that it just I wanted to share that because that’s how I relate to

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anthony_algmin: this and I imagine that others will, and it’s and it’s so sad that most I

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anthony_algmin: think most people never find that, never find

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anthony_algmin: that true passion of what their their lives work is about. So can you tell

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anthony_algmin: me more about how that daunt on you and how as you started to to like leap

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anthony_algmin: in all, in which I have a tremendous respect for. Because I think that’s the

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anthony_algmin: only way to do if you’re found your life’s work and you don’t jump in a

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anthony_algmin: hundred percent. Then you’re kidding yourself in a new way right

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anthony_algmin: So you saw that you’re like coach. How did you figure out what that context

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anthony_algmin: was for you and how you wanted to create a business around that. Talk me

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anthony_algmin: through that um, that experience for you,

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jerry_fu: yeah, yeah, I, you know, there’s this a great book called Designing your Life by

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jerry_fu: Bill Burnett and Dave Evans, And one of the best things about that book was, they

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jerry_fu: basically said. In, if you’re going to approach your life with a designed

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jerry_fu: mentality, then you recognize that the important pillars of life which include

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jerry_fu: work, love, play, and health right, these are iterative and you have to evaluate

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jerry_fu: these on a continual basis. Because what worked for you five years ago probably

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jerry_fu: isn’t working for you now. Right and then? what’s working for you now may not work

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jerry_fu: for you five years from now, and to be able to recognize that and continue to

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jerry_fu: experiment and you know Ha, involve friends right in the process. Hey, check my

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jerry_fu: blind spots and things like that. And so that really helped me because

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jerry_fu: I would notice along my journey right, what made me feel alive, right?

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jerry_fu: The, The One of the things that they ask you to do is to keep a good times

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jerry_fu: journal. Hey, what makes you feel alive? Oh, I really have fun. Uh, when I go

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jerry_fu: salsa dancing right, it’s like Oh, this makes you feel alive, or when I’m cooking

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jerry_fu: for friends and I have a meal together with them and we’re having meaningful

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jerry_fu: conversation. You know what? That’s That’s something. I need to take a note of and

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jerry_fu: same thing with coaching when I ask questions and I see clients kind of have that

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jerry_fu: epiphany And then not only do they have that epipany to act out in the way that

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jerry_fu: leads them to have this level of closure with, you know, a temperamental boss, or

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jerry_fu: you know they’re able to make some difficult but necessary decisions regarding

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jerry_fu: their career. Um, you start to realize, Hey, you know what I, I should in. I

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jerry_fu: should to have more of this right. I, I need to find a way to cut out, Uh, or

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jerry_fu: minimize the things that they don’t likely. you know, like admin, paperwork or

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jerry_fu: things like that right. we can automate. you know, invoicing things like that, Uh,

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jerry_fu: where we can Uh, hire someone else to do it if you have enough capital right, And

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jerry_fu: so when you realize Hey, let me start to you know, really be intentional about

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jerry_fu: expanding what I love doing, and you know, reducing what I, what I with drags on

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jerry_fu: me. Um, it’s not an evil or selfish thing. Really, we need people that are willing

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jerry_fu: to find a way to focus on what makes them come alive so that they can better

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jerry_fu: contribute Uh, for themselves and to the people around them that are important to

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jerry_fu: them and from there you know, not just strive for individual success, but to have

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jerry_fu: significance that goes well beyond Uh. their life journey,

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anthony_algmin: right so in in your coaching you have a specific emphasis

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anthony_algmin: on helping Asian American leaders,

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anthony_algmin: and with some challenges that are are unique to them. Can you talk

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anthony_algmin: about what those are and and how you’re targeting that community

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anthony_algmin: and and helping them solve those those problems.

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jerry_fu: Yeah, thanks for asking that. Yeah, a great question. Um, so I’ll give a an

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jerry_fu: example just so people can, kind of you know I, we’re not just talking in vague

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jerry_fu: here. So, uh, one of my friends when I was in college, one of my friends said Hey,

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jerry_fu: you know I’m this is during summer break. he’s like Hey, I’m going to be in your

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jerry_fu: area town. You know, Do you want to hang out for a couple of days And so I said

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jerry_fu: Yeah, you know, let me run it by my mom. Make sure that everything’s clear and

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jerry_fu: then Yeah, she says yes, then yeah, you know, come on over. hang out. and so this,

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jerry_fu: you know my friend comes over. He hangs out for a couple of days. My mom is a kind

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jerry_fu: and gracious host and you know we have good time. and then you know he leaves and

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jerry_fu: then not even like two hours after he left. My mom is like, Can you believe this

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jerry_fu: guy like you know he didn’t. He didn’t make the bed. When he was done, He, he left

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jerry_fu: hair and the shower like. I can’t. you know you know I, you can have him over

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jerry_fu: again, but I, I wouldn’t recommend it right.

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jerry_fu: and this is. This is the method of conflict resolution that I grew up with right.

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jerry_fu: Oh, you know, like let him say face, We don’t want to embarrass them, or you know,

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jerry_fu: tell us we don’t. We’re ashamed of what. that our expectations might be

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jerry_fu: unreasonable for them. So let’s just keep me keep that to their ourselves. And

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jerry_fu: then when they break them, you know, we secretly just kind of write them off and

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jerry_fu: you know they just don’t come over again right and we just get over whatever

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jerry_fu: resentment that were frustration we have with enough time passing Right And so,

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jerry_fu: but this is what I grew up with right and there’s also layered on top of the fact

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jerry_fu: that Chain pharmacy is telling me Hey, like if the patient’s being ofreasonable

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jerry_fu: like, just don’t antagonize them further and

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jerry_fu: so to give clients and really groups of organizations that have Asians that you

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jerry_fu: know are have. This mentality right, I, you mean, there’s find of organization Say

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jerry_fu: you know every time we check in with like our Asian employees, we ask him if

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jerry_fu: everything’s going fine and they always say yes, and then later we find out

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jerry_fu: there’s like some dumpster fire that they’re hiding Because they’re They’re too

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jerry_fu: embarrassed because they felt like the initial admitted that something is wrong

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jerry_fu: would imply that they’re incompetent When really the the worst problem is that

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jerry_fu: they’re not volun. They’re They don’t feel. Uh, you know, Uh, bold enough to

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jerry_fu: really volunteer this information right and so, uh, for example, Yeah, so one of

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jerry_fu: my clients at one point, you know, her boss called her after hours. He didn’t pick

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jerry_fu: up. He blew up out the next day and you know, questioned her commitment, even

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jerry_fu: though his expectations for the job were very vague. And so you know she asked me.

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jerry_fu: Well, you know, how do I handle this guy? Like, how do I address my frustration,

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jerry_fu: but not just getting fired because he’s already lost his temper once. And so you

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jerry_fu: know to give her a framework, Um, to tell her to say, Hey, go ahead and organize

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jerry_fu: your thoughts. Um, you know, write himem down on paper or organize them, Uh,

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jerry_fu: rehearse them right. And don’t just write him down and paper, rehearse them in the

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jerry_fu: front of a mirror with friends who can role play with you and then find ten

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jerry_fu: seconds of courage to say Hey, boss, Um, you know, do you have ten minutes? I, I

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jerry_fu: need to. I need your help trying to resolve something right. Um, and so to give

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jerry_fu: them the C. the courage, Uh, to move forward with these conversations so that they

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jerry_fu: can actually achieve closure and say and exhale and say. Oh, I’m so glad I got

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jerry_fu: that off my chest. Um, that is what I hope for them.

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anthony_algmin: Yeah,

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anthony_algmin: it

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anthony_algmin: is something that I think

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anthony_algmin: we often forget. Is that

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anthony_algmin: a lot of our

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anthony_algmin: proclivities are, or are what we interpret as individual or personal Like

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anthony_algmin: challenges or weaknesses

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anthony_algmin: aren’t genetic in nature. They aren’t. you know? we weren’t born with them,

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anthony_algmin: but we grew up because we were in an environment, or we learned a a

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anthony_algmin: behavior, or we, um, you know, had some particular struggle in our lives

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anthony_algmin: resulted in this, and those are are coachable changeable things. And and

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anthony_algmin: that’s something that there are patterns and and kind of cultural norms that

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anthony_algmin: can sometimes paint us into corners and make us. You know where it can be

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anthony_algmin: difficult for us to manage in a situation where the others around us find it

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anthony_algmin: very comfortable. And I think that’s uh. that can manifest in a lot of

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anthony_algmin: different ways, And I think you have. You have focused in on an in an area

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anthony_algmin: and a pattern that is relevant to you.

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anthony_algmin: Um, and as is relevant to your clients, and I think that you know for the

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anthony_algmin: audience out there. I think how many more kinds of patterns exist like that

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anthony_algmin: Or how many more challenges do we face That are like

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anthony_algmin: hey, we, we, We have this hang up or we

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anthony_algmin: have this challenge. It’s deep Like this is something that you don’t just

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anthony_algmin: say, Okay, I’m go to come to work and I’m going to be. I would be courageous

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anthony_algmin: today, and I’m gonna have not ha have address these issues out of like.

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anthony_algmin: That’s not possible. You need some support. You need some sort of assistance

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anthony_algmin: in even evaluating that circumstance. And and that’s what I find is

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anthony_algmin: interesting from a coaching or consultative perspective. is that,

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anthony_algmin: sometimes if you can just reframe the problem and and structure and

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anthony_algmin: understanding of the problem, the solution becomes a much more

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anthony_algmin: straightforwardd process like, even in just what you describe, I’m like.

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anthony_algmin: Yeah, can I think of things in my own life that I’m like. I really struggle

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anthony_algmin: with this. Is

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anthony_algmin: it because I’m a bad person, or is it because I’ve learned something or have

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anthony_algmin: conditioned myself to say to myself? Oh, I can’t handle this situation well

354
00:23:15,291 –> 00:23:19,125
anthony_algmin: because I am black and that I think is something that

355
00:23:20,416 –> 00:23:23,208
anthony_algmin: it’s gotten me thinking about that avenue. And

356
00:23:23,291 –> 00:23:27,291
anthony_algmin: I imagine that something that you as a coach are dealing with constantly

357
00:23:27,458 –> 00:23:28,500
anthony_algmin: like you’re helping people

358
00:23:29,875 –> 00:23:32,666
anthony_algmin: understand and address some of those things that even if they were

359
00:23:33,000 –> 00:23:35,208
anthony_algmin: completely thinking about it completely looking in the

360
00:23:35,208 –> 00:23:38,583
anthony_algmin: mirror, they wouldn’t even be able to see. Is that is that accurate?

361
00:23:40,291 –> 00:23:42,208
jerry_fu: Yeah, absolutely right, I mean

362
00:23:43,250 –> 00:23:47,833
jerry_fu: it’s It’s funny with reframing be cause. It is one of the essential things in not

363
00:23:48,041 –> 00:23:53,833
jerry_fu: just uh, coaching, but a lifestyle design and you have to reframe wisely right.

364
00:23:54,041 –> 00:23:56,916
jerry_fu: You can’t just say well, you know, it’s really not the bigg a problem, because

365
00:23:57,083 –> 00:24:01,583
jerry_fu: that’s what a lot of people do. Oh, I. I dealt with one organization where people

366
00:24:01,750 –> 00:24:05,750
jerry_fu: were, you know, showing up late, or they’re flaking out of meetings. and uh, when?

367
00:24:06,375 –> 00:24:10,291
jerry_fu: when you know leadership brought this up that people weren’t all that committed to

368
00:24:10,458 –> 00:24:14,208
jerry_fu: the group, and the the response was No, just well’, just lower your expectations.

369
00:24:14,291 –> 00:24:18,208
jerry_fu: That’s not the end of the world right. That’s not a good reframe. right. Oh, it’s

370
00:24:18,291 –> 00:24:22,541
jerry_fu: not the big a deal. Really, just you’ll live and it’s like Okay, No, uh, but it is

371
00:24:22,625 –> 00:24:25,833
jerry_fu: because reframing. Really. the clue of reframing right is like. Well, how can we

372
00:24:25,875 –> 00:24:29,333
jerry_fu: see this differently? Like even if we shift over the perspective by even five or

373
00:24:29,416 –> 00:24:33,500
jerry_fu: ten degrees? Like what? What new things do we notice so that we can continue to

374
00:24:33,666 –> 00:24:36,791
jerry_fu: work around this of this obstacle in such a way that we evenually get to other

375
00:24:37,000 –> 00:24:41,083
jerry_fu: side, even if it’s not the original way we thought we were going to take. Um, and

376
00:24:41,333 –> 00:24:46,291
jerry_fu: yeah, when you reframe like it’ like when it got fired right initially, even as of

377
00:24:46,458 –> 00:24:50,708
jerry_fu: about six or seven years ago, I remember telling my friend. You know getting fired

378
00:24:50,791 –> 00:24:55,416
jerry_fu: had be one of the worst thing ever happened to me And he pauses for a second and

379
00:24:55,500 –> 00:24:58,916
jerry_fu: he goes. Could you look it as the best thing this ever happened to you? And just

380
00:24:59,000 –> 00:25:02,375
jerry_fu: to just kind of judo, flipped the whole perspective and I said, you know, I guess

381
00:25:02,458 –> 00:25:06,875
jerry_fu: I have. to. What do I tell people Now? It was the wake up call right. It was the

382
00:25:07,083 –> 00:25:12,375
jerry_fu: the humbling moment. I needed to realize. Hey, you know what? Um, I need to? I

383
00:25:12,458 –> 00:25:17,583
jerry_fu: need to reevaluate and need to adapt, and you know I, I tell people now, Right

384
00:25:17,833 –> 00:25:21,500
jerry_fu: people get mad over things that like with bad breakups or whatever else like that,

385
00:25:21,583 –> 00:25:24,916
jerry_fu: And I just ask them and I don’t. I don’t state the case, because as soon as they

386
00:25:25,083 –> 00:25:28,875
jerry_fu: state the case, right, uh, they’ll start to push back and dick their heels in. But

387
00:25:28,916 –> 00:25:32,041
jerry_fu: if I just say something like, what if this could be the best thing that ever

388
00:25:32,041 –> 00:25:33,041
jerry_fu: happened to you

389
00:25:33,875 –> 00:25:38,708
jerry_fu: and I just let them kind of fill in their own, Um, you know evidence to to support

390
00:25:38,875 –> 00:25:42,375
jerry_fu: their stance if they’re willing to to uh, entertain the possibility.

391
00:25:44,041 –> 00:25:49,916
anthony_algmin: Oh man, so I I me think again, so I. I, I have this curse of

392
00:25:49,916 –> 00:25:50,916
jerry_fu: Okay,

393
00:25:52,166 –> 00:25:57,083
anthony_algmin: to like convince myself of anything like. I have this ability to like, be

394
00:25:57,083 –> 00:25:58,083
anthony_algmin: able to take

395
00:25:58,083 –> 00:25:59,083
jerry_fu: join the club,

396
00:25:59,166 –> 00:26:02,166
anthony_algmin: whatever my conclusion is, and yeah, and and and what what it has occurred

397
00:26:02,208 –> 00:26:03,208
anthony_algmin: to me at times.

398
00:26:03,208 –> 00:26:06,375
anthony_algmin: And I think this is also relevant, Kind of extending that whole notion of

399
00:26:06,375 –> 00:26:07,375
anthony_algmin: reframing

400
00:26:07,958 –> 00:26:10,333
anthony_algmin: you. We as individuals are

401
00:26:11,625 –> 00:26:13,541
anthony_algmin: a cou. There’s a couple of truths. We

402
00:26:13,708 –> 00:26:16,500
anthony_algmin: are not getting all the data. We don’t have access to

403
00:26:16,583 –> 00:26:17,625
anthony_algmin: all the Da. Do you think about what

404
00:26:17,791 –> 00:26:19,791
anthony_algmin: conflict you think about different perspectives, you think about

405
00:26:19,875 –> 00:26:22,666
anthony_algmin: what’s happening. We don’t have all the Da. We don’t have all the and every

406
00:26:22,916 –> 00:26:27,125
anthony_algmin: piece of data that we do comes in through this subjective filter in our

407
00:26:27,291 –> 00:26:30,916
anthony_algmin: brains, And then we tell, then we get going. Then we start

408
00:26:31,041 –> 00:26:33,291
anthony_algmin: telling the narrative around it, and we piece it together

409
00:26:33,416 –> 00:26:34,416
anthony_algmin: and we start spinning

410
00:26:35,041 –> 00:26:40,500
anthony_algmin: and we can find ourselves pretty far removed from reality in

411
00:26:40,666 –> 00:26:43,125
anthony_algmin: our interpretation of the limited data that we are

412
00:26:43,291 –> 00:26:47,125
anthony_algmin: subjectively analyzing to then come up with the conclusions that we are then

413
00:26:47,708 –> 00:26:49,291
anthony_algmin: over engineering. in our minds,

414
00:26:49,375 –> 00:26:50,375
jerry_fu: Mhm,

415
00:26:50,666 –> 00:26:52,750
anthony_algmin: It helps to reorient that,

416
00:26:53,541 –> 00:26:56,583
anthony_algmin: sometimes through an external perspective. Certainly, but

417
00:26:56,666 –> 00:27:00,833
anthony_algmin: I would. Also argue that it, it helps to get more data. It helps to get a

418
00:27:02,333 –> 00:27:07,625
anthony_algmin: more objective set of inputs wherever possible. I’ve I’ve even recently.

419
00:27:07,791 –> 00:27:13,541
anthony_algmin: I’ve been. You know, I’ve misinterpreted scenarios because the data that

420
00:27:13,625 –> 00:27:18,833
anthony_algmin: I have was skewed as I learned by gathering more data and my interpretation

421
00:27:19,000 –> 00:27:20,000
anthony_algmin: of it was

422
00:27:20,041 –> 00:27:23,541
anthony_algmin: not unreasonable, but was also incorrect because

423
00:27:24,041 –> 00:27:28,416
anthony_algmin: I had all I had like preconceived from certain date. I’d overweightated some

424
00:27:28,500 –> 00:27:32,041
anthony_algmin: of the the relevance of that data in absence of other data and led

425
00:27:32,250 –> 00:27:35,708
anthony_algmin: me to a conclusion that was just wildly wrong, just wildly the wrong

426
00:27:35,958 –> 00:27:40,583
anthony_algmin: conclusion and the wrong corresponding action. So I think that’s an. It’s an

427
00:27:40,750 –> 00:27:45,291
anthony_algmin: interesting thought around how we all encounter these kinds of situations,

428
00:27:45,625 –> 00:27:49,875
anthony_algmin: especially in careers and especially where like I’ve I’ve I long said like

429
00:27:50,041 –> 00:27:53,375
anthony_algmin: nobody cares about you as much as you do, you know.

430
00:27:53,791 –> 00:27:57,375
anthony_algmin: And and the we are not the center of the universe, but we’re the

431
00:27:57,458 –> 00:27:59,208
anthony_algmin: center of our universe. You know

432
00:27:59,375 –> 00:28:02,916
anthony_algmin: we are the most important person to us. Under most circumstances, granted

433
00:28:02,916 –> 00:28:03,916
anthony_algmin: family

434
00:28:03,916 –> 00:28:08,416
anthony_algmin: and all that are very important, but you filter things through that personal

435
00:28:08,416 –> 00:28:09,416
anthony_algmin: lens. and and

436
00:28:09,541 –> 00:28:14,166
anthony_algmin: I think having that kind of guidance or even just ability to start thinking

437
00:28:14,333 –> 00:28:17,625
anthony_algmin: in different ways, However you can do that is is a is a worthwhile pursuit.

438
00:28:17,791 –> 00:28:20,833
anthony_algmin: but I want to bring. I want to bring up an example that is

439
00:28:21,125 –> 00:28:25,000
anthony_algmin: unusually. Uh, this is that something I’ve ever been able to do with another

440
00:28:25,208 –> 00:28:26,250
anthony_algmin: guest, but I’m going

441
00:28:27,291 –> 00:28:28,541
anthony_algmin: to use an example from

442
00:28:28,541 –> 00:28:29,541
jerry_fu: go for it.

443
00:28:30,500 –> 00:28:31,958
anthony_algmin: this call. So as we

444
00:28:32,083 –> 00:28:33,708
anthony_algmin: got on to this call, I was

445
00:28:33,875 –> 00:28:35,541
anthony_algmin: two minutes late and

446
00:28:35,791 –> 00:28:38,583
anthony_algmin: part of it was because I had a little bit of technical issue getting on, but

447
00:28:38,750 –> 00:28:42,833
anthony_algmin: more of it was because I’m always two minutes late if I’m lucky these days,

448
00:28:42,916 –> 00:28:43,916
anthony_algmin: and I

449
00:28:43,916 –> 00:28:46,583
anthony_algmin: kinda, and I mentioned to you as we got on this call. I’m like I’m like,

450
00:28:46,583 –> 00:28:49,583
anthony_algmin: Yeah, I’m sorry’m, I’m a couple of minutes late. It’s this story of my life

451
00:28:49,583 –> 00:28:50,583
anthony_algmin: these days or whatever

452
00:28:50,666 –> 00:28:55,208
anthony_algmin: and I hate it. I hate it because I used to be punctual and I used to be like

453
00:28:55,541 –> 00:28:58,916
anthony_algmin: I would always be there. I would always be in time or whatever, and I

454
00:28:59,041 –> 00:29:04,166
anthony_algmin: am existing in in a an organizational culture that is not as punctual. And

455
00:29:04,166 –> 00:29:07,125
anthony_algmin: and that’s kind of our lives in the ▁zoom call world of covet, like we’re

456
00:29:07,375 –> 00:29:10,083
anthony_algmin: always going right up to the top of the hour. And then it takes a little bit

457
00:29:10,250 –> 00:29:12,583
anthony_algmin: of time to connect to the next thing. Where were? We’re running A few

458
00:29:12,666 –> 00:29:16,833
anthony_algmin: minutes late. But how you reconcile it be cause, and my, My solution up to

459
00:29:17,000 –> 00:29:20,083
anthony_algmin: now is just been throw at my arms be. I don’t know what to do versus

460
00:29:21,208 –> 00:29:24,500
anthony_algmin: like. Is there a better way to address that?

461
00:29:25,791 –> 00:29:29,291
anthony_algmin: A healthier way to address that where I know in the back of my mind every

462
00:29:29,541 –> 00:29:32,166
anthony_algmin: time it happens? it hurts because I hate

463
00:29:32,666 –> 00:29:36,833
anthony_algmin: not being punctual, but I’ve also had to acknowledge like I don’t know how

464
00:29:37,000 –> 00:29:41,375
anthony_algmin: to solve for that in reality is, or a better way to process that versus just

465
00:29:41,625 –> 00:29:44,833
anthony_algmin: doing what I did on on the call that we. We started a little while ago,

466
00:29:45,583 –> 00:29:50,375
jerry_fu: anthon, your your openness is is wonderful, so thank you for allowing us to impact

467
00:29:50,625 –> 00:29:54,458
jerry_fu: this because it depends really be cause. there’s no one right solution. I’ll give

468
00:29:54,541 –> 00:29:57,833
jerry_fu: you a couple of options to play around with, though, because punctuality is a

469
00:29:57,833 –> 00:30:01,333
jerry_fu: huge, huge thing for me, and I was late from nine o’clock this morning by two

470
00:30:01,416 –> 00:30:05,000
jerry_fu: minutes and I knew And plus it was with an Asian coach and I’m just like. Oh heck,

471
00:30:05,250 –> 00:30:10,125
jerry_fu: this I unpardonable. S right. just a little late. I got my computer up late and

472
00:30:10,208 –> 00:30:13,416
jerry_fu: turns out it was a phone call that she registered for, so I didn’t even have to

473
00:30:13,416 –> 00:30:17,000
jerry_fu: get my computer if I’d see know ▁zero, when on the number and my computer, Uh,

474
00:30:17,166 –> 00:30:20,541
jerry_fu: decide to upgrade everything while it was in standby. So you know all sorts of

475
00:30:20,541 –> 00:30:25,750
jerry_fu: excuses, but you have a couple of options here. Uh, so one example I’ll give. Um.

476
00:30:25,958 –> 00:30:30,041
jerry_fu: I’ll give a couple. But one example I’ll give is Um. When not, we teach leadership

477
00:30:30,208 –> 00:30:34,791
jerry_fu: workshops. We started to introduce the idea of what does the group want to own

478
00:30:35,166 –> 00:30:38,625
jerry_fu: Like, how do they want to make this theirirs? What kind of like guidelines or

479
00:30:38,708 –> 00:30:42,291
jerry_fu: rules do they want to establish for themselves? and they’ll say things like you

480
00:30:42,291 –> 00:30:46,916
jerry_fu: know. don’t interrupt. Uh, you know, keep your phone on silent, Uh, No, judging

481
00:30:47,166 –> 00:30:52,541
jerry_fu: right, Um, things like that and the couple that we always plant just to see if

482
00:30:52,625 –> 00:30:58,458
jerry_fu: they, you know it’s their choice to accept to reject it. One is punctuality and we

483
00:30:58,625 –> 00:31:03,166
jerry_fu: say Do you like starting on time? and I’m like. Well, Yeah, this. no one says no,

484
00:31:03,416 –> 00:31:08,125
jerry_fu: right and then we say Well, how do you want to define starting on time? Well, you

485
00:31:08,208 –> 00:31:12,125
jerry_fu: know, Yeah, at the top of the hour, and the someone, usually something someone

486
00:31:12,291 –> 00:31:15,250
jerry_fu: usually jumps in with. Oh, we. you have a five minute grace period, you know, and

487
00:31:15,416 –> 00:31:19,750
jerry_fu: then so that and that’s fine, you know. it’s it’s It’s negotiable with the group

488
00:31:19,958 –> 00:31:24,125
jerry_fu: as long as because the group now has a say in that. There’s more buying right

489
00:31:24,208 –> 00:31:27,333
jerry_fu: because it’s not just me telling them. Hey, you got to be on time because people

490
00:31:27,500 –> 00:31:31,416
jerry_fu: going. Yeah, I know, I guess you’d be on time. There’s no ownership. right. Um, so

491
00:31:31,500 –> 00:31:36,041
jerry_fu: if it’s something the group agrees to, they’re more likely to to own it and and

492
00:31:36,291 –> 00:31:39,833
jerry_fu: support it. So that’s one option you could take. the other is to

493
00:31:40,875 –> 00:31:45,166
jerry_fu: incorporate some creative or fun penalties. So, for one group one year, they said,

494
00:31:45,333 –> 00:31:48,458
jerry_fu: If you are late, and according to if if you arere beyond the five minute grace

495
00:31:48,708 –> 00:31:52,375
jerry_fu: period, you have to stand up and saying I’m a little teapot in front of the entire

496
00:31:52,625 –> 00:31:56,916
jerry_fu: group right, And we always recommend sons with gestures because you know just

497
00:31:57,000 –> 00:32:00,625
jerry_fu: making them sing is kind of boring. But if after I do the dance and spin around in

498
00:32:00,625 –> 00:32:05,958
jerry_fu: the circle, it’s great, Um, The other example that came to mind though, was Um,

499
00:32:06,708 –> 00:32:11,833
jerry_fu: the the band director in my middle school, Um, at the top of the hour, he just

500
00:32:11,958 –> 00:32:16,125
jerry_fu: locked the door. If you weren’t there by the time he was supposed to start, He

501
00:32:16,291 –> 00:32:19,916
jerry_fu: just locked the door, and you, Um, got a ▁zero for the day Because you weren’t

502
00:32:19,916 –> 00:32:20,916
jerry_fu: there.

503
00:32:20,916 –> 00:32:24,875
jerry_fu: I can guarantee you when you shape that environment to engineer out that flaw,

504
00:32:25,416 –> 00:32:27,000
jerry_fu: people may have resented it,

505
00:32:27,833 –> 00:32:30,708
jerry_fu: but it’s still was very effective. so

506
00:32:31,166 –> 00:32:35,333
jerry_fu: it’s really up to you as to what kind of solution you think you would Uh want to

507
00:32:35,583 –> 00:32:39,833
jerry_fu: support Right, because if you say hey, I’m I am a man of integrity. I, I want to

508
00:32:39,833 –> 00:32:44,375
jerry_fu: keep this promise to myself. You know, do I want to incorporate some fun rewards

509
00:32:44,708 –> 00:32:48,791
jerry_fu: if I, if I, for every day that I’m honor it and they get on like this streak of

510
00:32:48,791 –> 00:32:52,708
jerry_fu: like ten, twenty days where I am like. they’re not just on time at the top of the

511
00:32:52,708 –> 00:32:53,750
jerry_fu: are, but five minutes early.

512
00:32:54,291 –> 00:32:59,500
jerry_fu: Sure, or you could you know, have your computer shut down, you know, and have some

513
00:32:59,666 –> 00:33:03,416
jerry_fu: really, uh, get some money involved Right to? so think, if I am not on time, you

514
00:33:03,500 –> 00:33:07,250
jerry_fu: know today, then I have to donate two thousand dollars to like the charity that I

515
00:33:07,416 –> 00:33:11,166
jerry_fu: hate. you know, Like you know, for a cause. I don’t believe in right, and it’s

516
00:33:11,250 –> 00:33:15,250
jerry_fu: kind of funny how I would never engineer something like that for myself, but I do

517
00:33:15,500 –> 00:33:20,541
jerry_fu: know that, Um to trick myself forward in a way right, like when I ran my marathon.

518
00:33:20,791 –> 00:33:25,000
jerry_fu: When I registered for it, I knew that if I could just like pay the hundred

519
00:33:25,333 –> 00:33:28,541
jerry_fu: something dollars, I knew I was going to back out because I said Nope, I paid the

520
00:33:28,541 –> 00:33:31,708
jerry_fu: money I’m going to. I’m going to let that su cost bi. Us, like move me forward,

521
00:33:31,708 –> 00:33:32,708
jerry_fu: and it

522
00:33:32,708 –> 00:33:35,833
jerry_fu: didn’t matter how many people tried to talk me out of it. Um, I said no. I. I

523
00:33:35,875 –> 00:33:39,875
jerry_fu: committed to this and I, I, because nothing may be more upset than feeling like I

524
00:33:39,875 –> 00:33:43,583
jerry_fu: didn’t get my money’s worth out of something right. so uh, the question to ask

525
00:33:43,666 –> 00:33:46,625
jerry_fu: yourself. You know in the situation is you know? What kind of solution would you

526
00:33:46,625 –> 00:33:49,666
jerry_fu: respond best to? Do you need something where you kind of engineer out the flaw and

527
00:33:49,750 –> 00:33:54,708
jerry_fu: don’t even allow for. Uh, you know, Wiggle room, or you know, do you need a nicer

528
00:33:54,875 –> 00:33:58,541
jerry_fu: carrot to kind of reward you, or do you need some public accountability? Uh, with

529
00:33:58,625 –> 00:34:00,791
jerry_fu: some real consequences, it’s up to you.

530
00:34:01,375 –> 00:34:05,375
anthony_algmin: Hm, Well, and and it’s a situation in my context that I

531
00:34:05,625 –> 00:34:07,958
anthony_algmin: realize I cannot control the fact

532
00:34:08,166 –> 00:34:12,166
anthony_algmin: that meetings are going to start late and go long in my

533
00:34:12,250 –> 00:34:15,541
anthony_algmin: organization. I’m just not going to be able to assert that kind of

534
00:34:15,708 –> 00:34:16,833
anthony_algmin: influence. But I

535
00:34:17,000 –> 00:34:21,208
anthony_algmin: think your your point is well taken is is that I can create a framework for

536
00:34:21,458 –> 00:34:22,458
anthony_algmin: my own actions

537
00:34:23,041 –> 00:34:27,291
anthony_algmin: in a way that says Okay if we hit the top of the hour, Don’t care what the

538
00:34:27,291 –> 00:34:28,916
anthony_algmin: meanings. I can leave and get

539
00:34:29,000 –> 00:34:30,333
anthony_algmin: to the next meeting. I don’t

540
00:34:30,416 –> 00:34:32,500
anthony_algmin: have to stay a few minutes longer, and I

541
00:34:32,583 –> 00:34:35,375
anthony_algmin: can and I’ll own the consequences of that, but

542
00:34:35,625 –> 00:34:39,708
anthony_algmin: for the most part I think that that’s you know, thinking through. How can I

543
00:34:39,875 –> 00:34:41,875
anthony_algmin: manage that situation in a way that

544
00:34:41,958 –> 00:34:44,833
anthony_algmin: I find align with my internal values and

545
00:34:45,125 –> 00:34:49,708
anthony_algmin: will be hopefully minimally disruptive, but will also encourage that

546
00:34:50,833 –> 00:34:55,625
anthony_algmin: culture to evolve over time? Where if maybe I’m successful in becoming more

547
00:34:55,750 –> 00:34:56,750
anthony_algmin: punctual, Some of

548
00:34:56,833 –> 00:35:00,500
anthony_algmin: the people in my direct areas of influence will also become more punctual,

549
00:35:00,500 –> 00:35:01,500
anthony_algmin: which may

550
00:35:01,500 –> 00:35:06,291
anthony_algmin: create a punctuality. You know momentum that builds over time, and then

551
00:35:06,291 –> 00:35:07,291
anthony_algmin: maybe

552
00:35:07,375 –> 00:35:10,583
anthony_algmin: we actually improve things a bit more collectively. But it kind

553
00:35:10,666 –> 00:35:13,625
anthony_algmin: of can start with with my own actions, and I think that’s something to

554
00:35:14,083 –> 00:35:18,750
anthony_algmin: really think about because if it’s bothering me for as long as it has, I

555
00:35:19,000 –> 00:35:24,833
anthony_algmin: probably should do something so that I can at least own those behaviors more

556
00:35:25,000 –> 00:35:28,416
anthony_algmin: than just saying Well, I’m just gonna have to accept this thing that I don’t

557
00:35:28,583 –> 00:35:32,416
anthony_algmin: like. And and that’s not that’s not really my style. I often think there

558
00:35:32,500 –> 00:35:36,250
anthony_algmin: was. Um, I go back. I’ve I’ve long. S. like we all have those things that we

559
00:35:36,333 –> 00:35:39,625
anthony_algmin: call ourselves right, and we, we are like I am a person who is this or does

560
00:35:40,166 –> 00:35:43,958
anthony_algmin: are the ones for for me is that I, I will never forget. In high school we

561
00:35:44,041 –> 00:35:48,583
anthony_algmin: had our we have prom right, We have junior prom and and senior prom, And in

562
00:35:48,750 –> 00:35:53,125
anthony_algmin: my high school we had done. Uh, we were in the Chicago and and and uh, we

563
00:35:53,291 –> 00:35:58,666
anthony_algmin: did the prom my junior year of high school on this Um, on this boat on on

564
00:35:58,833 –> 00:36:02,041
anthony_algmin: one of the um, uh boats that goes out of Navy Pier, And you have like a

565
00:36:02,041 –> 00:36:03,541
anthony_algmin: little dance area or whatever. And like

566
00:36:03,708 –> 00:36:05,625
anthony_algmin: it was, it was kind of a funky prom

567
00:36:05,958 –> 00:36:08,916
anthony_algmin: thing on this bookat. But they had. they had booked this for like two or

568
00:36:09,041 –> 00:36:12,583
anthony_algmin: three straight years like they got a package deal. Oh, do two, you proms in

569
00:36:12,666 –> 00:36:16,083
anthony_algmin: a row, and I’ll and I will never forget. At the end of that prom everybody

570
00:36:16,500 –> 00:36:19,791
anthony_algmin: was like. Well, that was fine, but there’s no way we’re doing this again.

571
00:36:19,958 –> 00:36:22,625
anthony_algmin: and like there’s no way I’m signing up. I’m not going next year. The food

572
00:36:22,625 –> 00:36:23,625
anthony_algmin: was terrible. It was too

573
00:36:23,625 –> 00:36:26,666
anthony_algmin: expensive. the, but was kinda dumb. but it was awful right And we’re not

574
00:36:26,750 –> 00:36:31,125
anthony_algmin: going to do this next year. I was the only one who didn’t go the next year

575
00:36:31,375 –> 00:36:33,875
anthony_algmin: because of what I had said after the first one and I’m

576
00:36:34,041 –> 00:36:37,291
anthony_algmin: like I’m like I owned that decision and I’m like. Well, yeah, no,

577
00:36:37,375 –> 00:36:40,333
anthony_algmin: I’m not going my senior, because I said that and I meant that and I agree

578
00:36:40,500 –> 00:36:45,125
anthony_algmin: with that, so I’m not go to do that And and everybody else around me just

579
00:36:45,208 –> 00:36:47,541
anthony_algmin: went and did it anyway, Because it’s like senior problemm. of course you’re

580
00:36:47,541 –> 00:36:48,541
anthony_algmin: goingnna, go see a problem.

581
00:36:48,541 –> 00:36:52,750
anthony_algmin: I’m like I know what it’s go to be. I don’t. I don’t need it, and and I’ve

582
00:36:53,000 –> 00:36:57,291
anthony_algmin: long looked back on that a you know, partially sad that I missed my prom

583
00:36:57,625 –> 00:36:59,291
anthony_algmin: that all my friends were at, but

584
00:36:59,625 –> 00:37:04,083
anthony_algmin: partially very proud that I was willing to take that stand and hold firm and

585
00:37:04,166 –> 00:37:07,875
anthony_algmin: a thing that I actually believed in when I said and and and owned that

586
00:37:08,041 –> 00:37:11,125
anthony_algmin: decision and I followed through, and I’ve had that pattern throughout my

587
00:37:11,125 –> 00:37:13,000
anthony_algmin: career’. like Yeah, I follow through and things, I’m a

588
00:37:13,041 –> 00:37:16,583
anthony_algmin: person who follows through. I commit what I commit. I am in it, and so

589
00:37:17,208 –> 00:37:22,750
anthony_algmin: that is a fascinating thing that may not even have any point. but I think we

590
00:37:22,916 –> 00:37:26,916
anthony_algmin: all have those stories of that we tell ourselves about ourselves

591
00:37:27,625 –> 00:37:31,958
anthony_algmin: that lead us to these kinds of patterns and decisions that we ▁ultimately

592
00:37:32,041 –> 00:37:34,833
anthony_algmin: take in and in our careers, and and how we do. And I think that

593
00:37:35,000 –> 00:37:38,083
anthony_algmin: unpacking some of that is kind of a fun thing to think about. I haven’t

594
00:37:38,166 –> 00:37:39,291
anthony_algmin: thought about that in a while, but it’s

595
00:37:39,458 –> 00:37:42,333
anthony_algmin: it’s. It’s one of those things where it’s like. Do we

596
00:37:43,375 –> 00:37:47,791
anthony_algmin: have the ability to change? Like should I have gone back on that decision

597
00:37:48,083 –> 00:37:50,083
anthony_algmin: like everybody else did, or did

598
00:37:50,166 –> 00:37:52,666
anthony_algmin: it end up becoming a more valuable life lesson

599
00:37:53,458 –> 00:37:56,833
anthony_algmin: versus the fun I would have had at that time? I don’t know. Like all I know

600
00:37:56,916 –> 00:38:00,833
anthony_algmin: is the one that did happen, Um, and I and I look back on it, but I, i, now

601
00:38:01,000 –> 00:38:04,541
anthony_algmin: and I now take some element of of pride in that, but I think that too, like

602
00:38:04,541 –> 00:38:05,541
anthony_algmin: from

603
00:38:05,541 –> 00:38:06,916
anthony_algmin: your story perspective, right with some

604
00:38:07,000 –> 00:38:09,291
anthony_algmin: of these challenges that you had with different organizations. Whatever of

605
00:38:09,375 –> 00:38:11,208
anthony_algmin: you identifiedy. Hey, this is a thing that

606
00:38:11,541 –> 00:38:14,333
anthony_algmin: I need to overcome. I need to do better, and I’m going to create a business

607
00:38:14,500 –> 00:38:15,625
anthony_algmin: to help others do that.

608
00:38:16,250 –> 00:38:19,125
anthony_algmin: Um, you know that’s got to feel pretty good right like that’s got to be

609
00:38:19,208 –> 00:38:22,083
anthony_algmin: something that you can like. Hang your hat on and say you know what? Now

610
00:38:22,166 –> 00:38:25,000
anthony_algmin: I’m now I’m making a difference, so I’m starting to help people of

611
00:38:25,208 –> 00:38:26,416
anthony_algmin: real in in my career.

612
00:38:27,416 –> 00:38:32,125
jerry_fu: Yeah, of course, I mean you know, at at the very least, I’m glad that I. I tried

613
00:38:32,208 –> 00:38:36,125
jerry_fu: this out right cause there’s certain insights about driving you won’t get until

614
00:38:36,208 –> 00:38:37,500
jerry_fu: you get behind the wheel right,

615
00:38:37,666 –> 00:38:41,958
jerry_fu: and so to be able to try this out, and even if it fails and I don’t plan on

616
00:38:42,125 –> 00:38:45,416
jerry_fu: letting it fail. But even if it does to be able to say hey, you know what, I’m

617
00:38:45,583 –> 00:38:50,625
jerry_fu: glad I broke out of the status. ▁quot, and I just didn’t go along with my default

618
00:38:50,916 –> 00:38:55,250
jerry_fu: life plan. Uh, just because everyone else thought it would be, you know the right

619
00:38:55,583 –> 00:38:56,916
jerry_fu: and best thing for me right,

620
00:38:57,416 –> 00:39:01,833
jerry_fu: And you know it’s your decision right, Whether you said. Hey, you know what I

621
00:39:01,958 –> 00:39:04,875
jerry_fu: thought about what I said. And and I’m going adjust things. Say you still could

622
00:39:05,000 –> 00:39:06,125
jerry_fu: have gone to pro. I mean, maybe

623
00:39:06,291 –> 00:39:09,500
jerry_fu: there would be some Sc. and’d be like, Oh, a hypocrite thought that. it’s like.

624
00:39:09,500 –> 00:39:14,375
jerry_fu: Well, you know, and yeah, unfortunately, uh, the other factor to do things. Well,

625
00:39:14,458 –> 00:39:17,250
jerry_fu: the number one is you know, peer pressure makes us do a lot of things we don’t. We

626
00:39:17,250 –> 00:39:18,250
jerry_fu: wouldn’t do

627
00:39:18,250 –> 00:39:21,666
jerry_fu: otherwise And so it’s not that it goes away. You see to find the right peers

628
00:39:21,750 –> 00:39:26,375
jerry_fu: right. So if you want to run a marathon, hang out with marathoners right, Um, same

629
00:39:26,541 –> 00:39:30,875
jerry_fu: thing with identities, James Clear and Atomic Abus, talks about. Hey, if you say

630
00:39:31,166 –> 00:39:35,875
jerry_fu: I’m a smoker, but I’m trying to ▁quit, versus I am now a nonmor

631
00:39:36,458 –> 00:39:41,416
jerry_fu: right now. now, when you say well, this is just who I am. I’m a non smoker, right

632
00:39:42,125 –> 00:39:46,916
jerry_fu: like the identity is a two edged sort, because when you, I, when you’re willing to

633
00:39:47,333 –> 00:39:52,916
jerry_fu: assume an identity, Um, you’re attaching a lot of yourself and your values to this

634
00:39:53,083 –> 00:39:58,208
jerry_fu: identity. Right, and um, you know it may work for a while and their identities

635
00:39:58,458 –> 00:40:03,166
jerry_fu: that you may have to shed. Right, I, um, you know I am a child, and yet now I’m

636
00:40:03,333 –> 00:40:06,541
jerry_fu: you know. I’m not an actual father, But some people you know, some identities are

637
00:40:06,625 –> 00:40:10,916
jerry_fu: given to us whether we like them or not, but others uh. if we’re realized that we

638
00:40:11,000 –> 00:40:14,916
jerry_fu: can be intention about what identities of you know who we want to become. Uh, now

639
00:40:15,083 –> 00:40:19,000
jerry_fu: that’s you, have a very powerful tool in your tool boxs, as to how you can move

640
00:40:19,166 –> 00:40:23,416
jerry_fu: yourself overward To say, hey, yeah, I’m I’m a. I’m a regular exerciser Right or

641
00:40:23,416 –> 00:40:26,291
jerry_fu: now I’m a reader. I’m not just trying to read more books. I’m actually a reader

642
00:40:26,541 –> 00:40:27,833
jerry_fu: and readers read books.

643
00:40:29,125 –> 00:40:32,166
anthony_algmin: Yeah, well, and I was going to ask you like, what are some initial things

644
00:40:32,333 –> 00:40:34,666
anthony_algmin: that you can do, And I think you just answer that question

645
00:40:35,708 –> 00:40:40,666
anthony_algmin: around you reframing your own identity or even just evaluating what. What

646
00:40:40,833 –> 00:40:43,375
anthony_algmin: are those hats that you choose to wear that you say

647
00:40:43,625 –> 00:40:45,291
anthony_algmin: to yourself about yourself, and then

648
00:40:45,708 –> 00:40:49,000
anthony_algmin: which are those hats that you like and which ones or do not, And are you

649
00:40:49,041 –> 00:40:52,916
anthony_algmin: reinforcing those negative behaviors Because you personalized that as part

650
00:40:53,208 –> 00:40:57,375
anthony_algmin: identity, so that’ that’s an interesting, an interesting thought. So where

651
00:40:57,541 –> 00:41:01,125
anthony_algmin: do you see like? What are your plans for your business? Are you? are you in

652
00:41:01,375 –> 00:41:05,625
anthony_algmin: anticipating continuing to coach with like one on one. And and do you work

653
00:41:05,791 –> 00:41:10,083
anthony_algmin: with leaders from a like personal development standpoint? Or do

654
00:41:10,166 –> 00:41:14,250
anthony_algmin: you focus on career development? And where do you see this? Um, this

655
00:41:14,416 –> 00:41:18,666
anthony_algmin: business of yours are you’re expanding it and growing to overtime. What?

656
00:41:18,666 –> 00:41:19,666
anthony_algmin: your goals for that?

657
00:41:20,541 –> 00:41:25,083
jerry_fu: yeah, yeah, thanks for asking that. Um, I mean for right now, right, uh, the mean.

658
00:41:25,333 –> 00:41:28,375
jerry_fu: The one thing I’m happening to tell you guys, I’ve only been open a year, and the

659
00:41:28,458 –> 00:41:32,708
jerry_fu: main thing that saved my cashfulow this year was privateutoring, right like I did

660
00:41:32,875 –> 00:41:35,958
jerry_fu: have enough clients to cover all these start of costs that you don’t realize you

661
00:41:36,041 –> 00:41:39,083
jerry_fu: have until you start paying them. and you’re just like, Oh, I need a a Canva

662
00:41:39,250 –> 00:41:43,666
jerry_fu: license, you know, website insurance, Ohly, cow. like, no wonder people charge.

663
00:41:43,958 –> 00:41:47,416
jerry_fu: you know hundreds of dollars an hour. you know, because there’s always things you

664
00:41:47,500 –> 00:41:52,708
jerry_fu: don’t see. Um, but yeah, so the a goal? uh, it’llv always involve when I’m

665
00:41:52,916 –> 00:41:57,750
jerry_fu: coaching. That’s really. Um, even if like the clients obviously don’t necessarily

666
00:41:57,833 –> 00:42:02,041
jerry_fu: have as deep pockets as corporations do. But I think that’s where the real impact

667
00:42:02,208 –> 00:42:06,291
jerry_fu: you see the really impact where people say. Yeah, you know, I, finally, I was

668
00:42:06,458 –> 00:42:10,708
jerry_fu: scared for my career past, so I actually sat down with my boss and we talked about

669
00:42:10,791 –> 00:42:14,541
jerry_fu: what skill says I need to develop, so that I don’t get caught up in the next round

670
00:42:14,541 –> 00:42:15,541
jerry_fu: of cuts

671
00:42:15,541 –> 00:42:19,250
jerry_fu: right, That’s a good. That’s a good thing to talk about, Um and then

672
00:42:19,500 –> 00:42:23,416
jerry_fu: organizations. Yeah, whether they need d e, I trading and say, Hey, how do we deal

673
00:42:23,500 –> 00:42:27,166
jerry_fu: with this right? There are some inherent things in our subconscious or unconscious

674
00:42:27,416 –> 00:42:31,416
jerry_fu: biases that are still affecting us even though we’ve had plenty of like, ▁quote,

675
00:42:31,666 –> 00:42:35,958
jerry_fu: trainings and powerpoint about whater the right and wrong things to do. Right, Um,

676
00:42:36,291 –> 00:42:40,541
jerry_fu: and then, otherwise, yeah, let me just do some online courses where people don’t

677
00:42:40,625 –> 00:42:44,541
jerry_fu: even necessarily need me to be present, Uh to do the bulk of their own self

678
00:42:44,791 –> 00:42:49,875
jerry_fu: improvevement, And so uh, yeah, the main focus of any workshops I do will be

679
00:42:50,041 –> 00:42:54,458
jerry_fu: around relationships and conflict and how to really leverage that conflict as a

680
00:42:54,541 –> 00:42:59,083
jerry_fu: blessing, and at the same time right I’m I’m not. There are some secondary offers

681
00:42:59,250 –> 00:43:03,250
jerry_fu: like personal development to say, hey, Jerry, how did you become? Uh, you know a

682
00:43:03,416 –> 00:43:08,125
jerry_fu: musician. How did you become a better cook? How did you become? You know a a salsa

683
00:43:08,291 –> 00:43:13,083
jerry_fu: dancer. How did you become? You know all these other things, and so you know to

684
00:43:13,166 –> 00:43:17,166
jerry_fu: offer my own path that they can learn from it and develop themselves. Of course,

685
00:43:17,333 –> 00:43:18,375
jerry_fu: that’s always going to be available.

686
00:43:19,541 –> 00:43:22,416
anthony_algmin: Yeah, well, and I think that you know one of the strengths that you’ll have

687
00:43:22,500 –> 00:43:26,750
anthony_algmin: in your in your coaching practices is you know being open and sharing that

688
00:43:27,041 –> 00:43:31,791
anthony_algmin: own personal journey. I think that you know being open, being vulnerable,

689
00:43:32,166 –> 00:43:36,041
anthony_algmin: You sharing that and helping others learn from. It is such

690
00:43:36,166 –> 00:43:42,083
anthony_algmin: a you know rich way to impact others that you know. it’s it’s.

691
00:43:43,125 –> 00:43:47,125
anthony_algmin: It’s one of the most human and beneficial things that that you can do. And

692
00:43:47,125 –> 00:43:50,833
anthony_algmin: and I certainly appreciate you. Um, you know, coming on the show today, and

693
00:43:50,833 –> 00:43:54,083
anthony_algmin: and talking about some of that, and you know, enlightening our audience

694
00:43:54,416 –> 00:43:57,375
anthony_algmin: about your journey and your offerings. But hopefully you know we’ve all

695
00:43:57,458 –> 00:44:01,208
anthony_algmin: thought a little bit more about our own lives, our own careers, our own

696
00:44:01,458 –> 00:44:04,500
anthony_algmin: passions, and some of the things that we want to work on. I think that’s

697
00:44:04,583 –> 00:44:08,083
anthony_algmin: also a very human thing, is that we’re never going to be satisfied with who

698
00:44:08,166 –> 00:44:11,875
anthony_algmin: we are or what we are, and and what we do. and like, we’re always trying to

699
00:44:12,083 –> 00:44:15,625
anthony_algmin: improve. And and I think that Um, you know, getting a little bit of of help.

700
00:44:15,791 –> 00:44:18,750
anthony_algmin: getting a little bit of different perspective. Like so many other contexts.

701
00:44:19,125 –> 00:44:22,916
anthony_algmin: this is a a, a very valuable thing, Uh, that you’ll be doing for for your

702
00:44:23,000 –> 00:44:25,625
anthony_algmin: clients and and for our audience out there from from the

703
00:44:25,708 –> 00:44:29,291
anthony_algmin: show. So Jerry, thank you so much for for being on the show today and and

704
00:44:29,541 –> 00:44:32,666
anthony_algmin: helping us. Uh, all see things from a little bit of a different perspective.

705
00:44:33,416 –> 00:44:37,958
jerry_fu: Yeah, you’re welcome. if anybody wants to. you know. Reach out to check out the

706
00:44:37,958 –> 00:44:42,208
jerry_fu: website AdaptingLeaders.com. Uh, there’s a free p. d f that you can get on

707
00:44:42,291 –> 00:44:45,875
jerry_fu: hard conversations, schedule a complementary thirty minute call or just check out

708
00:44:45,958 –> 00:44:50,708
jerry_fu: my blog. Where summarize useful leadership books and offer other life hacks.

709
00:44:50,875 –> 00:44:51,875
jerry_fu: So yeah, feel

710
00:44:51,875 –> 00:44:52,625
anthony_algmin: Awesome, and

711
00:44:52,625 –> 00:44:54,375
jerry_fu: to check and take me up on those. absolutely

712
00:44:54,500 –> 00:44:57,625
anthony_algmin: yes, please do. And and everyone out there. thank you for joining us today.

713
00:44:57,708 –> 00:45:01,041
anthony_algmin: You’ll find more information and links in the show notes. Uh, propel your

714
00:45:01,125 –> 00:45:04,166
anthony_algmin: daated leadership journey with my book, training and other services at

715
00:45:04,250 –> 00:45:07,875
anthony_algmin: Algmin.com. Stay safe during these unusual times and go make an

716
00:45:07,875 –> 00:45:08,875
anthony_algmin: impact!

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